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    • Best ~$60k sports car? Comparing the 2020 BMW F87 M2 Competition, Shelby GT350 Mustang, MKV Toyota Supra, and Porsche 718 Cayman

      Car and Driver got their hands on four very hot cars in the ~60k price range. Amazingly, yes, you can put the 718 Cayman and Ford GT350 Mustang in the same sentence if going by their base price. The GT350 is actually the more expensive car in that case.


      Options creep up on Porsches though and it is the most expensive of the group but you can indeed compare these cars by price range.

      So, what is the best? Well, Car and Driver gets it right but they also get the last place car wrong. That car being the BMW M2 Competition.

      Last place? Really? So a Toyota doing a BMW impression with an inferior motor and transmission options is the better driver's car? Not to mention, a manual transmission example was tested and it was the quickest in the 1/4 mile. A DCT version would easily be the fastest car in this comparison.

      So power is not the emphasis for the M2's finish yet the Porsche 718 Cayman is punished for supposedly not having enough power. They fault it for having a four-cylinder but seem to forget to mention a more powerful 2.5 liter is an option along with a naturally aspirated flat-6.

      If the 718 had more power it would win this? Yet the M2 having the strongest motor is faulted for vague steering whereas the 718 has the best steering of the group? These people need to pick a standard and stick to it.

      The Supra finishes ahead of the 718 yet if this is about the best driver's car how is a car without a manual option better? Especially when it is much heavier too? The Supra is said to be a bargain but it really isn't at almost $60k. The C8 Corvette is a bargain.

      Now, the first place car is the GT350 and it should be the first place car. It's incredible. As we stated a long time ago, Ford now builds a better M3 than BMW. There is nothing else like the GT350 on the market and that V8 alone is worthy of worship.

      The result should be as follows:

      1. GT350
      2. 718 Cayman
      3. M2 Competition
      4. Toyota Supra

      Giving the Supra credit for value when it is only a few grand cheaper (which can be negotiated on the other cars) is just plain stupid. Punishing the 718 for power when it offers the best steering feel while stating the M2 is punished for steering feel is odd as well.

      Whatever, typical Car and Driver.






      This article was originally published in forum thread: Best ~$60k sports car? Comparing the 2020 BMW F87 M2 Competition, Shelby GT350 Mustang, MKV Toyota Supra, and Porsche 718 Cayman started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 16 Comments
      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Iím surprised the GT350 doesnít cover the 1/4 mile quicker and faster than a 12.5 @ 117 with 526 HP. Not a very effective use of power. However, that skidpad number is impressive!

        Side note: Iím not sure why these publications think it is okay to deviate from the industry standard metrics used to test performance, but it makes it tough to get an idea of a vehicleís true performance when they are changing the parameters. For instance, they are measuring braking distances from 70-0 MPH, but the long-standing norm is 60-0 MPH. This is not the first time Iíve seen this, so maybe 70-0 is becoming the new norm? Not sure, but thatís annoying.
      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Oh, and the GT350 wins this comparison by a landslide on sound alone LOL.
      1. maxnix's Avatar
        maxnix -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Eleventeen Click here to enlarge
        However, that skidpad number is impressive!
        Mustang was only car with PS Cup tires.

        What is really wacky is the different octane numbers which make me think at least two different tracks and skidpads were employed.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Eleventeen Click here to enlarge
        Oh, and the GT350 wins this comparison by a landslide on sound alone LOL.
        Parts falling of and hitting the road should not count.
      1. Bowser330's Avatar
        Bowser330 -
        These car mag morons think it’s okay to compare top gear acceleration times automatic vs manual, when they don’t put the automatic into manual mode to keep it in top gear. They allow the automatic to shift down and then lie that it’s a top gear acceleration.

        Real suspicious that in the top gear accelerations, 30-50 and 50-70, the automatic cars absolutely killed the manual cars.

        30-50mph in top gear
        Supra (auto) = 2.7 seconds
        Cayman (auto) = 4.5 sec
        M2 (manual) = 8.5 sec
        Gt350 (manual) = 11.0 sec

        There is no way in hell that in top gear (8th gear) the Supra is accelerating from 30-50 in 2.7 seconds or 50-70 in 2.9 seconds, that is made up, they allowed the automatic cars to down shift. The manual cars were left in top gear hence the disparity.
      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bowser330 Click here to enlarge
        These car mag morons think itís okay to compare top gear acceleration times automatic vs manual, when they donít put the automatic into manual mode to keep it in top gear. They allow the automatic to shift down and then lie that itís a top gear acceleration.

        Real suspicious that in the top gear accelerations, 30-50 and 50-70, the automatic cars absolutely killed the manual cars.

        30-50mph in top gear
        Supra (auto) = 2.7 seconds
        Cayman (auto) = 4.5 sec
        M2 (manual) = 8.5 sec
        Gt350 (manual) = 11.0 sec

        There is no way in hell that in top gear (8th gear) the Supra is accelerating from 30-50 in 2.7 seconds or 50-70 in 2.9 seconds, that is made up, they allowed the automatic cars to down shift. The manual cars were left in top gear hence the disparity.
        I see what youíre saying and I think you are totally right. WTF is the point of doing the test that way LOL? Honestly, top gear acceleration a stupid test anyway, because top gear is always designed for saving fuel.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Eleventeen Click here to enlarge
        I’m surprised the GT350 doesn’t cover the 1/4 mile quicker and faster than a 12.5 @ 117 with 526 HP. Not a very effective use of power.
        Look at who is driving. Guys who know what they are doing have them in the 11's.

        Car and Driver can't launch unless a computer does it for them.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bowser330 Click here to enlarge
        These car mag morons think it’s okay to compare top gear acceleration times automatic vs manual, when they don’t put the automatic into manual mode to keep it in top gear. They allow the automatic to shift down and then lie that it’s a top gear acceleration.

        Real suspicious that in the top gear accelerations, 30-50 and 50-70, the automatic cars absolutely killed the manual cars.

        30-50mph in top gear
        Supra (auto) = 2.7 seconds
        Cayman (auto) = 4.5 sec
        M2 (manual) = 8.5 sec
        Gt350 (manual) = 11.0 sec

        There is no way in hell that in top gear (8th gear) the Supra is accelerating from 30-50 in 2.7 seconds or 50-70 in 2.9 seconds, that is made up, they allowed the automatic cars to down shift. The manual cars were left in top gear hence the disparity.
        Good observation and you are 100% correct.

        It's crap like this that shows their 'quality' testing.
      1. Stevenh's Avatar
        Stevenh -
        Attachment 59548

        Here's a good laugh. This was at AutoNation Arapahoe Toyota (Denver area) today.
      1. richpike's Avatar
        richpike -
        Wow! I almost fell out of my chair on that one Click here to enlarge

        -Rich
      1. Bowser330's Avatar
        Bowser330 -
        What a joke, the only exclusivity the "launch edition" provides is interior red leather and a carbon fiber plaque

        No mechanical differences to the launch edition either.

        Yet they want to sell it for a $50K markup? Click here to enlarge

        https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...aunch-edition/
      1. Sticky2's Avatar
        Sticky2 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Stevenh Click here to enlarge
        Attachment 59548

        Here's a good laugh. This was at AutoNation Arapahoe Toyota (Denver area) today.
        Did you take this pic?
      1. Stevenh's Avatar
        Stevenh -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky2 Click here to enlarge
        Did you take this pic?
        Yup.

        I was considering trading the Macan in for a 4Runner (no go. they're pretty rough) so I was at the dealership and figured I'd take a peek. I forgot to take an honest look at the Supra after seeing the price and laughing so I have no real feedback there.
      1. Sticky2's Avatar
        Sticky2 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Stevenh Click here to enlarge
        Yup.

        I was considering trading the Macan in for a 4Runner (no go. they're pretty rough) so I was at the dealership and figured I'd take a peek. I forgot to take an honest look at the Supra after seeing the price and laughing so I have no real feedback there.
        Well done.
      1. Stevenh's Avatar
        Stevenh -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bowser330 Click here to enlarge
        What a joke, the only exclusivity the "launch edition" provides is interior red leather and a carbon fiber plaque

        No mechanical differences to the launch edition either.

        Yet they want to sell it for a $50K markup? Click here to enlarge

        https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...aunch-edition/

        Meanwhile, I drove there in my 1 of ~1,300 total production TTRS that is worth 50% of sticker. There are very, very few cars with collectors value today.

        I honestly think the markup is a PR stunt for internet attention. Id bet you could pay near msrp if you showed up cash in hand.
      1. Bowser330's Avatar
        Bowser330 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Stevenh Click here to enlarge
        Meanwhile, I drove there in my 1 of ~1,300 total production TTRS that is worth 50% of sticker. There are very, very few cars with collectors value today.

        I honestly think the markup is a PR stunt for internet attention. Id bet you could pay near msrp if you showed up cash in hand.
        Collectors value today is very rare, it's pretty much reserved for hyper cars for the hyper rich, e.g.
        La Voiture Noire - Bugatti




      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Stevenh Click here to enlarge
        Attachment 59548

        Here's a good laugh. This was at AutoNation Arapahoe Toyota (Denver area) today.
        This is why dealerships and car salesmen get a bad name. The most infuriating part is that some $#@! will definitely buy it at or near that price, justifying the dealershipís decision to sell it so high over MSRP (further perpetuating the practice).